 |
|
 |
|
|
interview
Eight Strings Attached and No Worries:
An Interview with Charlie Hunter
musictoday:
Feeling better now?
Charlie Hunter:
Today is the first day that I feel like I am almost normal. I am still trying to take it easy, 'cause I don't wanna get that again. I live on the fourth floor, so I really have to take my going up and down the stairs seriously. I can end up doing it like twenty times a day if I am not careful.
mt:
At least you are staying in shape.
CH:
I do a lot of stuff to stay in shape already, so I don't need these goddamn stairs. [He snickers.] So what's going on?
mt:
Well, I was reading your bio on your website, and there were a few things that intrigued me about where you grew up in Berkeley. More specifically, how you grew up, and what social circles you were involved in. You said that you came from a lower-income family, yet you went to a relatively large school for music. Talk about how that influenced how you went about trying to expose music, and how that helped shape your style and musical accessibility.
CH:
Coming up, it's not like we had a terrible life, by any means; there just wasn't a lot of money around. Coming up that way gave me a real appreciation for what it is like to actually have a job. I was a furniture mover, I worked in a candle factory, and a million other manual jobs. It made me kind of appreciate people who have those kinds of jobs and can't really afford to go out to a jazz club, yet would really enjoy the experience. I mean, I try to keep the ticket price at a more affordable rate.
mt:
Do you believe that people are driven to certain music forms, because the only way they can listen to it is by free means, via radio or television? Do you feel that you have a responsibility to expose to them this jazz you are playing?
CH:
I don't know if I am saying that I play jazz music, I just play what I like to play. I just try to put myself in a situation that makes me comfortable. Playing places that are a little more relaxed makes me feel more comfortable, and makes me feel more of a vibe from the audience. That makes people from all walks of life feel a little less apprehensive about going into a place and seeing music.
mt:
Talk about the audience that comes to a show. How diverse are they? How does that affect how and what you play? Do you come prepared with a set, or do you feed off of what the audience is vibing on?
CH:
It really depends on where we are going to play and what we are playing at the time. A lot of times, I will go up with a setlist, so I don't have to worry about going up there and worrying about having dead time. I really like to keep it moving along. I try to go up there and do more of a show, rather than just going up there and playing through tunes. It is important what tune you start with and end with, what goes in the middle, et cetera.
mt:
Does your crowd consist of younger people? I have yet to see you live, and I am curious about what kind of people are being drawn to your music.
CH:
Okay, well I think it is probably more people in their twenty and thirties. As you move upwards from there, there is probably less.
mt:
Do you feel they have a strong understanding of the influences that you have, for instance someone like [Thelonious] Monk? Or is this something very new for them?
CH:
I think it is a little of both. It all depends on the person. Some people really know a lot of the music that I listen to and are there for that reason. Some are just interested in hearing guitar. Some are there because their friends brought them. The bottom line is that if the music doesn't affect people in the way that it is supposed to affect them, and then it doesn't really matter.
mt:
Speaking of listening to guitar, what was your motivation behind playing an eight-string guitar? What drove you toward the unorthodox, kept you from just playing traditionally?
CH:
I just like to be a self-sufficient person. This was something that intrigued me, and I wanted to see whether I could do it. It slowly came out of playing the standard six-string guitar stuff, like Joe Pass was doing; that was no problem to play on the six-strings. The only thing was that the bass range was so limited. I felt like I really wanted to have that bass feel, as well as the guitar feel. Now, I am at the point where I am kinda thinking of it like it was back in the day, when they first made a drum kit. Before that, it was a guy with a bass drum with a little symbol on it, and another guy playing a snare drum. Then they put those two things together, and one guy played it. They had to create a vocabulary for it. I feel that is what I am doing with this instrument that I am playing. I am kinda creating a vocabulary for it.
mt:
When you took guitar lessons when you were younger, did you study classical?
CH:
No. I just studied the basics of how to play the instrument.
mt:
I was curious, because, of the classical guitarists I have seen, there is much focus on the independence of the thumb. I assume you play the bass strings with your thumb, correct?
CH:
It's the independence of the right hand for rhythmic counter-point between the bass and guitar part. I mean, classical guitar technique is a lot different than mine, because the strings I use are much heavier gauge than a classical guitarist. They can rely on a lot of very blatant stuff, like their right hand when the resistance is very small, whereas the resistance I have is very heavy, because the bass strings I have have to be very thick to create a decent tone. So I really have developed a whole different technique for playing that pretty much just applies to this instrument.
mt:
I am really interested in traveling. I have traveled my whole life. Traveling does a lot for an individual, being able to go out and experience different cultures and seeing what else is out there in the world. I understand that you did a lot of traveling in Europe. You played on the streets all over Europe. How did that affect you and your understanding of music and your ability to connect on a larger level with your playing?
CH:
We had our own little culture, the "buskers." We busk, meaning we play on the street. We had our own culture within the culture we were in. We were like gypsies, in a way. We weren't really part of the greater culture when we were in France or Switzerland. We were there, so there was an opportunity to learn languages and cultures, which was very interesting. As far as the music, you have to play twelve hours a day to make a living. You have to play music that is going to make people stop. It taught me a lot about putting on a show.
mt:
What kind of response did you get in Europe, versus the responses that you received in the states? What kind of tunes garnered the bigger responses?
CH:
You know, we would play everything from jazz standards to R&B tunes. We would have vocal harmonies and stuff like that. I feel as if every crowd is different, everywhere you go. As long as you have good stuff, it usually will translate.
mt:
That's physical traveling, but what about mental or emotional traveling, in the sense that you have reinvented yourself multiple times in music? Do you feel that you are unsatisfied constantly, or searching for something? What in you makes you want to try something new?
CH:
I think you kind of said it. To me the satisfaction is in evolving and getting better at what I do. That's the satisfaction. So if I am not moving forward, then I am not satisfied. But I am happy where I am at present, as long as I am moving forward.
mt:
At the risk of sounding overly cheesy, do you feel like you are on a quest for a particular sound that you can strictly call your own?
CH:
Definitely. We are all trying to find our own sound and own identity in the music. That's the eventual goal. You can work on something like that your whole life.
mt:
Let's talk a bit about the Duo project. I am curious about you playing with only one other person, and how challenging it is to be on stage with little backing. Could you elaborate on that a little?
CH:
It's great. For one, it puts you in a position where you have to evolve, because you have a lot of responsibility. On the other hand, it is great when you get up there to do it, because the communication is really great between just two people.
mt:
Did you find yourself trying to create more elaborate pieces to try to fill the gaps?
CH:
Not necessarily. With every different person you play with, you are going to get into a different modus operandi. I just try to let it go in the direction it is supposed to go.
mt:
How is playing with Leon Parker?
CH:
Great. He has been a great influence on my playing.
mt:
You met him when you went to New York, right?
CH:
Yes.
mt:
How has the move to New York affected you and your playing?
CH:
It made a man out of me.
mt:
The city is very inspirational in more than one aspect. Do you find that you are going out a lot to see other live music, or are you a more introverted individual?
CH:
I go out about once a week. I just don't like nightclubs. I have to be in them so often that I try and stay away from them.
mt:
Who do you go to see, when you are out? What kind of stuff are you listening to, now?
CH:
Not really so much jazz music, but I like to hear singer/ songwriter stuff. A lot of Brazilian music, Cuban music, and African music. I am really interested in that.
mt:
Do you want to explore a more world-music style, in the near future?
CH:
I don't know. I just listen to a lot of different stuff and try to let it in.
mt:
Let's talk about the new album a little. You have Leon Parker on it. Peter Apfelbaum, his last name means "apple tree," in German. I didn't know whether you knew that.
CH:
Yeah. Ich spreche ein bischen German. [Translation: "I speak a little German."]
mt:
Josh Roseman on Trombone, Stephen Chopek and Robert Perkins, whom are both students of Leon. Stop when I get something wrong. Is this Stephen and Robert's first time on record?
CH:
I think it is.
mt:
How was playing with "rookies," so to speak?
CH:
They were kinda following Leon. He made up these percussive arrangements to the music I wrote. It came out pretty cool.
mt:
I got a chance to hear the album.
CH:
Great.
mt:
It kinda shocked me. My expectations were that your music was going to get funkier, but it got chiller. I love it. Do you think that the more mature you get, the more laid-back you are becoming with the music?
CH:
I think it's just that I am getting more relaxed.
mt:
Can you talk a bit about the changes you have gone through, as a guitarist, to get to this point?
CH:
You know, it's just like I am getting more and more technique on my instrument. Which allows me not to be so scattered when I play. Which allows me to get more calm and collected, so if I want to get all ignorant and nasty, I can get ignorant and nasty, and if I want to get nice and clean, well, I can do that, too. It's just a matter of having more control.
mt:
On your guitar, it seems like you like to go for a more organ-sounding effect. What draws you to the organ sound? What particular organ players influenced your style?
CH:
Organ players were the only people doing what I wanted to do with the simultaneous bass and melody. I checked out a lot of Larry Young, Big John Patton, and Jimmy Smith.
mt:
I have a quote here.
CH:
Uh-oh.
mt:
Yup. Just a little something. It's one of yours. I just wanted you to elaborate on it a little. It says here: Charlie said of the experience [of working with D'Angelo on the Voodoo album], "This is one of the most challenging sessions that I have worked on." Why was that? Could you speak a little about the experience of playing with people that come from a hip-hop or "neo-soul" movement, as some are now calling it? I really can't stand that name...
CH:
Well, soul has been dead for about twenty years, so "neo- soul" is a good way to put it. It was challenging, because Amir (?uestlove of the Roots) and D'Angelo were so deep into their thing. Kinda like Leon and I are, or me and Adam Cruz. To come and play with us, it would take a while to figure out what was going on. That is kinda the way it was with them. I stepped in with those guys, and they already had a real rapport and a real communication. It took me a minute to find out what that was. But then I felt like I got it and really got into it and had a great time.
mt:
I read somewhere that, with those sessions, you recorded the songs multiple times and got tons of tapes, but actual tracks that made the CD were like the first or second takes. Is that true?
CH:
That might be true. But I don't remember playing those songs more than one or two times.
mt:
Was there something in the philosophy of the people you were playing with that made them want to go for that Coltraney, Milesesque, capture-the-moment feel?
CH:
I don't think at the time they were thinking about that. I think that we just got together to play and see what could happen.
mt:
Do you carry that philosophy in your recording sessions?
CH:
Definitely. I would rather have a take that has a good vibe and strong rhythm feel that has me playing mistakes all over it than one that is very polished and boring.
mt:
Is that something that you would incorporate into the "soul" formula?
CH:
Yes.
mt:
What other things do you feel were lost in music that might have contributed to the death of soul music?
CH:
I think that, somewhere in the '80s, it turned from a singer/songwriter medium to more of a producer's medium. I feel like that is when it got lost.
mt:
Do you believe that corporate interest in music plays a big part in it?
CH:
Most definitely. Because their interest lie in... It isn't really the record business anymore, it is the "music industry." They are not music people who are running the industry. They are accountants and lawyers. They are interested in, I feel, in only enriching themselves. The music that they choose to put millions of dollars behind, marketing, is not music that is for society in general. It is junk music, in the same way that McDonalds is junk food. It can still be called food, 'cause you can eat it and it passes through your body, but there is no nutritional value in it. It does more harm to your body than it does good. That kind of defeats the purpose for eating. You get no nutrition from it; all you do get is fat and disease. The same can be said about music that is not produced in a healthy way, with a healthy rapport with the community in mind, healthy intentions. I feel it is the same kind of thing.
mt:
I like that metaphor and would like to expand on it a little. With food, oftentimes it is more costly to cultivate something well. You pay more for organic fruit than you would for waxed fruit at your local crapmart...
CH:
That has more to do with the fact that everything in the industry is tilted toward manufacturing that junk food. So that means that each individual has to manufacture that good food themselves, so it is going to cost more money. That is the same thing I am trying to do. We want to make music that is really good and stands by itself, regardless of the music industry. I mean, a McDonalds hamburger without the gigantic arch or the large distribution network they have is nothing. It is nothing without television. But really good food, like organic grown steak, man, you can't beat it. There is no denying which one is better.
mt:
Back in '93, you were touring with U2 and Primus...
CH:
I think that was '91 or '92, at the latest.
mt:
That is definitely a different scene. Talk about being in that arena and performing that style of music to that style of audience.
CH:
Well, that was just a gig for me. I mean, that wasn't my band. I was a working musician. It was either that or moving furniture. So I did that. As far as my playing, it didn't really do that much for it. As a matter of fact, it probably made it not as good, because I wasn't playing with people who were a lot better than me. It was a hell of an experience. Not a bad experience, but, musically, it didn't do much for me.
mt:
Did being involved in the industry in that aspect kind of push you away from wanting to move in that direction?
CH:
Definitely! I just realized that if I was going to do it, I was going to have to do it on my own terms.
interview by Damani
top of page
|
|
|
